Nobody Should Believe Me
Author Andrea Dunlop investigates Munchausen by Proxy abuse after her sister was accused of it. She interviews experts and examines cases to understand this form of abuse. The podcast explores the criminology and psychopathology behind the condition.
Episodes
Who Speaks for the Children with Elizabeth Bartholet
During our Season 7 conversation about the parents' rights movement, Andrea spoke with Professor Elizabeth Bartholet, who recently retired from Harvard Law School after more than three decades focused on child welfare, children's rights, and adoption. In this bonus episode, we're sharing more of that important conversation as they dig deeper into children's rights, the influence of advocacy groups
Child-Centered Advocacy with Roxanna Asgarian
In this extended conversation from season 7, Andrea sits down with journalist and author Roxanna Asgarian. Together, they explore how media narratives shape public understanding of child protective systems and the parents' rights movement.
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Try out Andrea’s Podcaster Coaching App: https://studio.com/apps/andrea/podcaster
Order Andrea’s book The Mother Next Door: Medicine, Deception, and Munc
Season 7 Mailbag Part 2
Andrea and Myrriah are back for part two of our season seven mailbag, revisiting some of the conversations that generated the most discussion this season. As they reflect on some of the biggest themes of season seven, they unpack ongoing debates around child abuse investigations, public perceptions of child welfare, and the stories we tell about families, medicine, and harm. Along the way, they di
Season 7 Mailbag Part 1
Andrea and executive producer Myrriah are back on the mic for part one of our season seven mailbag episode: answering listener questions, reflecting on the stories that resonated most this season, and sharing some behind-the-scenes thoughts on the reporting process. From the reactions to John Stewart and the Knowellan Kelly case to ongoing conversations about abusive head trauma, media narratives,
Introducing: Aaron | Betrayal Weekly
Betrayal Weekly is back. Aaron was committed to supporting the woman he loved, no matter the cost. Then one day, he asked for receipts.
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Listen to Betrayal Weekly: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/betrayal-weekly/id1615637724
If you would like to share your story, you can reach out to the Betrayal Team by emailing them at betrayalpod@gmail.com and follow them on Instagram at @betrayal
Kyle's Story
In the season seven finale, Andrea spoke with Kyle about his experience surviving Munchausen by proxy abuse. In this bonus episode, we're sharing an extended cut of that conversation, giving Kyle the space to tell his story in full. Despite losing years of his childhood to abuse, Kyle's journey is ultimately one of extraordinary resilience, survival, and reclaiming his own story.
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Try out And
What We Get Wrong About Abuse and How to Prevent It with Dr. Jackie Campbell
In this bonus conversation, Andrea sits down with intimate partner violence researcher Jacquelyn Campbell to look at how complex issues like domestic violence and child abuse really are, compared to how simply they’re often portrayed. Together they explore what it might look like to intervene earlier and what it would take to build systems that recognize danger before tragedy strikes.
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Try ou
S07 E10: The Stakes
As we close our season, we hear from two people whose lives were forever altered by child abuse; and in doing so examine what’s really at stake when the media misrepresents child abuse cases and the work of child abuse doctors.
Featuring:
Tara Haelle, Science Journalist
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Try out Andrea’s Podcaster Coaching App: https://studio.com/apps/andrea/podcaster
Order Andrea’s book The Mother N
Introducing: PRETEND: Chain of Command Part 1
In 1996, Sarah DeJonghe was a 20-year-old Navy Seabee stationed in Okinawa, Japan. Two guys in uniform approached her on base and invited her to church. She said no.
They came back anyway.
Four months later, Sarah was out of the Navy and on her way to a Bible seminary in Washington State. She didn't see it coming. Neither did the dozens of other military members who found themselves drawn into t
S07 E09: Who America Considers a Family
As the media weaves a narrative about evil doctors kidnapping children: the real harms caused by the child welfare system go unnoticed. Today we look at the case for strengthening children's rights as well as the case for replacing the child welfare system altogether.
Featuring:
Roxanna Asgarian, Child Welfare Journalist
Elizabeth Bartholet, Professor of Law at Harvard Law School
S07 E08: Anatomy of a Conspiracy Theory
Why do all of these stories purporting false allegations of child abuse sound the same? If enough people have experienced the same thing, that must mean it’s true, right?
The truth is, as soon as you do a little digging, these cases begin to unravel. By taking a closer look into the cases featured in Serial’s The Preventionist and Mike Hixenbaugh’s Do No Harm, the copy and paste storytelling bec
S07 E07: Selling a Story
Stories of “false” allegations of child abuse build on each other to paint the picture of a widespread problem that can affect anyone who brings there child into a hospital. None have made more of an impact than those featured in Take Care of Maya.
The first half of this season was dedicated to John Stewart, and 15-month-old Knowellan Kelly, but what about the other 3 families shown at the end of
S07 E06: The Experts
Child abuse pediatricians have become increasingly villainized in the media despite being among the most specialized and cautious doctors in child abuse medicine. Andrea looks at what these doctors actually do and why their role is so often misunderstood.
Andrea also explores the rise of paid defense experts who offer alternative explanations in abuse cases that fall far outside the medical conse
Introducing: Love Trapped
Infamous Bachelor Clayton Echard’s real drama began after the rose. He left the show disgraced and determined to start over. That’s when a one-night fling spiraled into a nightmare that would lead Clayton into a years-long battle to prove the truth. Host and reporter Stephani Young investigates the twisted case.
If you would like to reach out to the Love Trapped team, email them at lovetrapped
S07 E05: Beyond a Reasonable Doubt
John Stewart is arrested shortly after Knowellan’s death, but despite what appears to be strong evidence of abuse, the case against John is never taken to court. Andrea traces how we ended up here, ten years later, with no one held accountable for taking the life of a child.
Featuring Experts:
Dr. Sally Smith, Child Abuse Pediatrician
Mike Weber, Former Crimes Against Children Detective
Introducing: Truer Crime
On Easter Sunday in 1993, the Southern Ohio Correctional Facility in Lucasville erupted into chaos. Tensions between prisoners and staff had reached a breaking point, sparking one of the longest prison sieges in U.S. history. Over eleven days, nine inmates and one corrections officer would lose their lives. But what caused the riot? And for the hundreds trapped inside, what did it mean to survive
S07 E04: Something was Wrong
Investigators work to reconstruct Knowellan Kelly’s final hours in the care of John Stewart and his grandfather. John claims there is exculpatory evidence that proves he didn’t hurt Knowellen, but is that really the story the evidence tells?
Featuring:
Dr. Sally Smith, Child Abuse Pediatrician
Dr. Russell Vega, Medical Examiner
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Try out Andrea’s Podcaster Coaching App: https://studi
S07 E03: Two Steps
After 15-month old Knowellan Kelly is rushed to the hospital following a seizure, doctors discover catastrophic injuries. Andrea walks through the medical evidence with experts whose findings point to repeated inflicted trauma. As investigators struggle to reconcile conflicting accounts from John Stewart and Knowellan’s mother and grandfather, a tangled web emerges.
Featuring:
Dr. Sally Smit
S07 E02: What Happened to Knowellan Kelly?
After John Stewart, a Florida man charged with–but never prosecuted for–the death of his girlfriend's 15-month old son reaches out to Andrea to tell her she’s all wrong about his case Andrea goes on a deep dive to find out what really happened to Knowellan Kelly, the baby who lost his life ten years ago. John–who was featured in Take Care of Maya–claims that doctors and investigators falsely accus
S07 E01: The Catalyst
Welcome to Season Seven of Nobody Should Believe Me. Andrea revisits the case of Maya Kowalski—the story at the center of the Netflix film Take Care of Maya–and the family’s high-profile lawsuit against Johns Hopkins All Children’s Hospital. What became widely framed as a story about “medical kidnapping” began when hospital staff reported suspected medical child abuse after Maya arrived with a his
Season 7 Trailer
Season 7 of the groundbreaking true crime podcast Nobody Should Believe Me investigates why so many Americans believe doctors are “medically kidnapping” children from innocent parents.
Florida man John Stewart insists he was falsely accused of the murder of 15-month-old Knowellan Kelly—a story media outlets and documentary filmmakers have echoed in sympathetic portrayals. But a months-long invest
Revisiting Kowalski Part Four: The Aftermath
In this final recap episode, we revisit the final months of Maya Kowalski’s sheltering at Johns Hopkins All Children’s Hospital and the tragic events that followed. While the dependency case and abuse investigation continued, tensions within the Kowalski family were escalating. After a difficult court hearing in January 2017, Beata Kowalski died by suicide, leaving behind emails asking others to “
Revisiting Kowalski Part Three: The Breaking Point
In the third part of our Kowalski recap, Andrea walks through the events that led to Maya’s hospitalization and what hospital staff observed in those first days. As doctors quickly became concerned about both Maya’s condition and the unusual treatments she had been receiving, the hospital brought in a child abuse pediatrician and an investigation into possible medical child abuse began.
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Try
Revisiting Kowalski Part Two: The Descent
In this episode, Andrea sheds light on the disconnect between the narrative presented publicly vs the medical records and trial testimony. She traces how ketamine became the driving force in Maya Kowalski’s treatment from Dr. Anthony Kirkpatrick. What followed was a rapid escalation: four-day ketamine infusions, increasingly alarming blog posts written in Maya’s voice, and ultimately a controversi
Revisiting Kowalski Part One: The Turn
Andrea has been following the Kowalski v Johns Hopkins All Children's case since it first received national attention, and previously covered it in depth in our third season. Within this 4-part series, we’re revisiting the case with the benefit of additional trial testimony, released records, and appellate developments. In this first part, we’re going back to 2015 to revisit the events that set th
Cramped! With Kate Downey
In this conversation, Kate Downey, the host and creator of the podcast Cramped, shares her personal journey with severe period pain and the challenges she faced in the medical system. She discusses the lack of understanding and research surrounding women's health issues and emphasizes the importance of advocacy, education, and open conversations about women's health.
Kate and Andrea also explore
Gypsy-Rose Blanchard Part 2
In Part Two of Andrea’s conversation with Gypsy-Rose Blanchard, Gypsy reflects on systemic failures by doctors and child protective services and the long-term impact of being conditioned to fear helpers. She also shares what it’s been like to unlearn harmful coping mechanisms and build healthy relationships while reconnecting with family. Their conversation culminates in a hopeful note as Gypsy di
Gypsy-Rose Blanchard Part 1
In this episode, Andrea talks with Gypsy Rose Blanchard about life after surviving Munchausen by proxy, incarceration, and becoming a public figure without her consent. Two years after her release from prison, Gypsy reflects on what it means to build a sense of self after years of extreme control, medical abuse, and sudden media attention.
Their conversation explores the realities of Munchausen
The Lisa Campbell Goins Case with Mike Weber
In this episode, Andrea is joined once again by retired detective and medical child abuse expert Mike Weber to discuss a case that closely mirrors patterns we saw in season 6 of the show. The conversation centers on a caregiver who presented a child as chronically and mysteriously ill, resulting in repeated hospitalizations and invasive medical interventions.
Together, Andrea and Mike examine th
The Warrior Eli Hoax Part 2 with Taryn Wright
In part two of Andrea’s conversation with writer and former hoax hunter Taryn Wright, the discussion shifts from the Warrior Eli case to the broader impact of exposing deception online. Together, Andrea and Taryn explore the rise of attention as its own form of currency and the ethical challenges of telling these stories responsibly.
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Try out Andrea’s Podcaster Coaching App: https://studio.
The Warrior Eli Hoax Part 1 with Taryn Wright
In the early 2010s, a heartbreaking story circulated widely online: a family documenting their young son Eli’s battle with cancer, following the sudden death of his mother. When investigative writer Taryn Wright came across the story, what began as casual curiosity quickly led to a shocking series of revelations about a story thousands of strangers had become deeply invested in.
In this episode,
Justina Pelletier Part 2 with Beau Berman (rebroadcast)
In part 2 of Andrea’s Justina Pelletier coverage, she’s joined by Beau Berman, the reporter that broke this story.
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On this show we talk a lot about how Munchausen by Proxy cases are covered in the media, and today we’re getting the inside scoop from the reporter who broke one of the most high profile MBP stories. Beau Berman began covering the Justina Pelletier case back in 2013 as a young r
Justina Pelletier Part 1 (rebroadcast)
As 2025 comes to a close and we look forward to season 7, we’re airing the first part of Andrea’s coverage on the Justina Pelletier case—the case that opened the Pandora’s Box of medical kidnapping coverage in the media.
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Case Files is back with the first episode of a multi-part series on the Justina Pelletier case. Andrea and Dr. Bex covered this case in the subscriber feed, but, due to popu
Jesika Jones Part 2 with Derek Jones (rebroadcast)
In the second episode of Andrea’s coverage of the Jesika Jones case, she’s joined by Derek Jones, Jesika’s then-husband. Derek bravely tells the story of how he and Jesika met, their home life, and the decline in their daughter's health. Talking to Derek gives listeners insight into the manipulative nature of perpetrators, not only with their victims, but also with everyone around them, and the me
Jesika Jones Part 1 with Detective Mike Weber (rebroadcast)
Today we’re re-airing part 1 of the Jesika Jones case in Texas. Look out for part 2 with the father, Derek Jones, in the feed tomorrow!
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This week on case files, Andrea is joined by Detective Mike Weber, a crimes against children investigator and long-time friend/contributor to the show, to discuss the Jesika Jones case. Detective Mike is called onto this case in mid-2022 after Jesika brings
Catching Up with Mishelle and Aunt Sabrina
In this follow-up to Season 6, Andrea reconnects with Mishelle and her aunt Sabrina to talk about life after sharing Collin’s story. They reflect on what it’s been like to have this information out in the world, the reactions from their community, and the personal toll of public disclosure. Mishelle shares major life updates, while Sabrina speaks about the mix of relief and vulnerability that com
What “The Preventionist” Left Out with Dr. Randy Alexander
In this episode, we close out our coverage of Serial’s The Preventionist with Dr. Randy Alexander, one of the most experienced child abuse pediatricians in the country and the former supervisor of both Dr. Deborah Jensen and Dr. Sally Smith. Randy explains how the media’s portrayal of CAPs as all-powerful fundamentally misunderstands how these cases work and ignores the layers of oversight built i
How Do We Prevent Child Abuse? With Kathleen Strader
This week we’re re-releasing Andrea’s conversation with Kathleen Strader from Prevent Child Abuse America. While Nobody Should Believe Me is, at its core, raising awareness about Munchausen by Proxy abuse, we’ve been pulled into the larger question of “how do we make sure children are safe in their homes?”. We’ll continue exploring that next week during Andrea’s interview with Dr. Randy Alexander
The Human Cost of “The Preventionist” with Dr. Sally Smith
In this episode, Dr. Sally Smith is back on the mic to share her reaction to the recent appellate ruling that overturned the massive judgment against Johns Hopkins All Children’s Hospital in the Maya Kowalski case. She talks about what the decision means for mandatory reporters, why she sees it as vindication of her work, and what it’s been like to be cast as a media villain simply for following t
Introducing: Dakota Spotlight Season 12
Meanwhile in Mankato: Lies, Silence & Murder in Minnesota
In 1965, a teenager killed a gas-station clerk near Mankato and was sentenced to forty years. He served five.
Decades later, Dakota Spotlight retraces his path — from prison to parole, from murder to manipulation — and discovers new revelations that still shock those who lived through it.
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Listen to Dakota Spotlight: https://podcasts
Dr. Jessica Pryce on the Harms of the Child Welfare System
In light of the overturned ruling of Kowalski v Johns Hopkins and Serial’s The Preventionist, we’re reairing an episode from our Kowalski season in which Andrea dives into the complexities around reporting child abuse suspicions.
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With the jury's stunning $242 million verdict in favor of the Kowalski family, host Andrea Dunlop looks at why this case has struck such a nerve on both sides of th
“The Preventionist” Erases Munchausen by Proxy with Dr. Jim Hamilton
In the second part of Andrea’s rebuttal to The Preventionist, Serial Productions’ podcast on child abuse pediatrician Dr. Debra Jenssen, she speaks with Dr. Jim Hamilton, a leading expert on Munchausen by proxy. They break down how prevalence statistics are misused, what The Preventionist gets wrong, and why leaving out key details—like the Steltz’ teenage son coming forward and emancipating himse
Kowalski v Johns Hopkins overturned with Ethen Shapiro
In this episode, Andrea sits down with Ethen Shapiro, trial counsel for Johns Hopkins All Children’s Hospital, to unpack the landmark appellate decision overturning the $200 million verdict in the Kowalski v. Johns Hopkins case. Ethen explains how the ruling reinforces the immunity given to mandatory reporters acting in good faith when reporting suspected abuse. Together, they explore how the deci
Case Files 25: Olivia Gant Part 2
In this episode, Andrea continues delving into the Olivia Gant case with Detective Melissa Kalish, who uncovered the vast fraud and abuse behind Kelly Turner’s lies. Kelly continued to exploit compassion: fabricating diagnoses, staging her daughter’s suffering, and committing large-scale Medicaid fraud.
Within days of Olivia’s death, she entered new relationships, inventing pregnancies, fabricati
Abuse Survivors and Victims Deserve Better than 'The Preventionist'
In response to Serial Productions’s series The Preventionist, we’re re-airing our episode “What’s Happening in Lehigh?”, where Andrea and Dr. Marc Feldman dive into the claims of “overdiagnosis” of Munchausen by Proxy in Lehigh, PA. This episode includes an intro covering some key details missing from Serial's reporting.
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This week Andrea is joined by Dr. Marc Feldman as she dives into the co
Case Files 25: Olivia Gant Part 1
The disturbing parallels between Collin McDaniel and Olivia Gant's cases led Andrea to speak with Melissa Kalish, the lead detective in the investigation of Kelly Turner, for season 6. Now we’re diving deeper into Olivia’s story in a two part series where Detective Kalish walks listeners through her investigation into this case of medical child abuse.
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Justice for Collin: https://docs.google.
Introducing: Affirmative Murder
This week Fran and Alvin discuss food, Pakistan, and American history.
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Listen to Affirmative Murder: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/340-em-eye-ess-ess-eye-pee-pee-eye/id1296864488
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Answering Your Season 6 Questions
In this episode, Andrea and the Nobody Should Believe Me team reflect on the emotional impact of making season 6 and the ethical considerations of reporting on Collin’s story. They also address listener feedback, explore the roles of perpetrators and medical professionals, and highlight the importance of accountability in philanthropy and child protection systems. Their conversation emphasizes the
Introducing: Fruitloops
Two cousins. Four murders. One homicidal summer. In 2004, Angel Ford-Wright & Caroline Peoples lured victims with false promises, then executed them. One confessed. One went to trial. Both got life.
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Listen to Fruitloops: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/fruitloops-serial-killers-of-color/id1400426755
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True Story Media Presents: Fruitloops
Welcome to the final installment of True Story Media Presents! This week Andrea is talking to Wendy and Beth, the creators behind Fruitloops: Serial Killers of Color. The three of them chat about how they first met and what drove Wendy and Beth to dive into true crime podcasting. They reflect on the shared thread of how cultural and societal ideals shape policy and how that engages with true crime
Introducing: PRETEND
LaDonna Humphrey. Remember that name because she is central to this story. I've tried to sum up this tale quickly, but every time I attempt an elevator pitch, I fail. When friends ask me what this new series is about, I'm at a loss for words. It's impossible to explain in just a few minutes.
I'm about to retell the story the way I learned it: completely out of order. By the end, you'll need a sus
True Story Media Presents: PRETEND
In the third installment of True Story Media Presents, Andrea sits down with Javier Leiva—host and creator of PRETEND. The two talk about how they first connected, their new partnership under True Story Media, and the overlapping themes in their work. They dig into the emotional toll of telling true crime stories, and Javier shares his path from local news and documentary filmmaking into the world
Introducing: Dakota Spotlight
September 1998 brought a chilling moment in Bismarck, North Dakota, when 17-year-old Aimee walked into the police station. She suspected her boyfriend, Brian Erickstad, had harmed his parents. A welfare check was meant to set things straight — but it uncovered something far worse.
Episode 1, A Little Red Car, introduces Barbara and Gordon Erickstad’s case, a North Dakota true crime story that ex
True Story Media Presents: Dakota Spotlight
In this special crossover, Andrea talks with James Wolner, creator of Dakota Spotlight—another show in her True Story Media network—about how a rumor in a rural North Dakota bar led him to pick up a microphone in 2019 and start chasing the truth. Together, Andrea and James dig into what it means to practice ethical reporting in a medium with no rules.
James shares a case from season three of Dako
True Story Media Presents: Affirmative Murder
We’re kicking off our new series introducing the shows of True Story Media, Andrea’s ethical true crime network. In this conversation, Andrea sits down with Alvin, the host and creator of Affirmative Murder, to talk about the wild landscape of podcasting in 2025. They dive into questions of diversity and representation, the ethics of telling real-life stories, and what’s at stake when we shine a s
S06 E10: Ripple Effects
This week, we hear more from Mishelle about the impact of The Guthy Jackson Foundation’s response to the revelations about Lisa McDaniel is having on her family. We examine how Lisa’s long tenure with the foundation shaped research, messaging, and trust in the NMO community, and what it means when one person’s deception ripples out so far.
We also hear from listener Bekah Rhea, whose perspective
S06 E09: Fallout
As the story of the McDaniel family continues to send shockwaves through the communities Lisa was involved with, we check in with Mishelle about what else has come to light and what her mother has been up to since the season aired.
We take a deeper dive into the of role of The Guthy Jackson Foundation–Lisa’s former employer– and cover how they’ve responded to the news about Lisa.
We also speak
Case Files 24: Women Who Lead Double Lives with Sarah Treleaven
Today we have a very special crossover episode with journalist and host/producer of The Con: Katilyn’s Baby, Sarah Treleaven. Sarah and Andrea recount how they met many years ago and the similarities in their work with Munchausen and Munchausen adjacent stories. Sarah reveals a personal story about how she got into this line of work.
Kaitlyn’s Baby, is about a woman that had been serially fabrica
Case Files 23: Mike Weber Retirement Special
Welcome to the Mike Weber Retirement Special! Mike gives us a brief glimpse into what he’s been up to since retirement and talks to Andrea about his experience publishing their co-authored novel, The Mother Next Door. Andrea asks Mike to give his thoughts on the Lisa McDaniel case from a law enforcement perspective, and he details his outreach to the Birmingham Police Department, stressing the imp
NSBM After Hours: Anatomy of Lies Part 1
We're unlocking an episode from the subscriber feed. Enjoy!
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This is the first part of Andrea and Dr. Bex’s coverage of the Peacock documentary series “Anatomy of Lies”. The show dives into the story of Elisabeth Finch, who was best known as a head writer on “Grey’s Anatomy”, and the lies that her life was built on. In their conversation about the first part of this docuseries, Andrea and Dr.
S06 E08: May He Rest
In our season finale, Andrea comes face-to-face with Lisa McDaniel, the woman at the center of this story when she arrives on her doorstep with television journalist Meredith Anderson to request an interview.
As they process the revealing conversation with Mishelle, they reflect on the ripple effects that this story has already had on the McDaniel family, and for Lisa’s former employer, the Guth
S06 E07: Cleaning Out the Basement
Mishelle recounts how she and her sister, Angellyn, stumbled upon their past medical and court records while helping Lisa and Carey move. This discovery prompted the sisters to reach out to people who could offer a perspective unfiltered by their mother’s influence: Judy, the PICU nurse who once treated Angellyn, and Bea Yorker, the Munchausen by proxy expert who testified against Lisa more than t
S06 E06: Dr. Ness
On this week’s episode, we hear Mishelle’s phone call with Dr. Jayne Ness, Collin’s treating physician, who shares concerning insights into Collin’s treatment—notably, that she was never certain Collin had NMO and that she had serious concerns for abuse. Andrea then speaks with Dr. Kenneth Feldman, a Child Abuse Pediatrician and Clinical Professor of Pediatrics at the University of Washington, abo
S06 E05: “But she’s my mama”
As Lisa escalates Collin’s medication regimen and pushing for risky experimental treatments, we examine the gulf between Lisa’s reports of Collin’s symptoms and known cases of NMO.
We also see the beginning of Lisa’s connection to the Guthy Jackson Foundation, a high-profile non-profit, dedicated to NMO awareness and research. Collin’s condition rapidly declines, and he is placed on hospice car
S06 E04: The Caretaker
Mishelle describes her brother Collin as a vibrant little boy who loved to joke around and make people laugh. All of that changed, seemingly overnight. Sabrina and Mishelle walk Andrea through their memory of the timeline of Collin’s symptoms, and his eventual diagnosis with NMO (Neuromyelitis Optica). This recounting of events exposes some discrepancies in the family’s memory and Lisa’s public st
S06 E03: “Open, Reliable, and Trustworthy”
We begin this week’s episode with a young Mishelle struggling to adjust to life with her grandparents, finding it difficult to accept both the separation from her parents and the reality of what her mother had done. Meanwhile, Lisa is in the midst of a police investigation, undergoing a psychological evaluation and attending therapy.
We hear from Bea Yorker—an expert in Munchausen by Proxy and th
S06 E02: “How Could Someone Do That to a Child?”
Lisa’s second child, Angellyn, was born prematurely and in a medically fragile state. Mishelle and her aunt Sabrina recount a troubling pattern: just as Angellyn would be cleared for hospital discharge, doctors would abruptly reverse course, warning that she might not survive the night.
Andrea speaks to a nurse, “Judy”, who was working in the Pediatric Intensive Care Unit (PICU) at the time of An
S06 E01: The Advocate
This season on Nobody Should Believe Me, we tell the story of Lisa McDaniel, who crafted a public image as the Director of Patient Advocacy at the Guthy Jackson Foundation while concealing her conviction for child abuse more than a decade ago.
We begin with an introduction to the McDaniel family: Lisa, her husband Carey, and their children—Mishelle, Angellyn, and Collin. While the unraveling of t
Case Files 22: Rady Children’s Part 6
This week on Nobody Should Believe Me, Andrea and Dr. Bex dive further into the allegations against Dr. Paolo Bolognese, discussing the whistleblower complaint that exposed unnecessary medical treatments as well as sexual harassment accusations. They explore how deceptive marketing and the glamorization of medical authority can lead to real harm—especially for patients with complex or misunderstoo
Season 6 Trailer
Season 6 of Nobody Should Believe Me–out weekly starting June 19, available in full for subscribers at launch– covers the extraordinary and tragic saga of the McDaniel family, a real-life Southern Gothic tale of Munchausen by Proxy that spans decades and has left untold damage in its wake.
For the past twelve years, Lisa McDaniel worked for The Guthy Jackson Foundation, a high-profile non-profit
Case Files 21: Rady Children’s Part 5
This week, Andrea and Dr. Bex dive into the controversial Dr. Paolo Bolognese, a neurosurgeon with a significant number of malpractice lawsuits and explore his role in the Rady Children's lawsuit.
Andrea and Dr. Bex also highlight the complexities of medical malpractice, particularly in neurosurgery, emphasizing the risks associated with experimental procedures and the importance of informed con
Case Files 20: Rady Children’s Part 4 with Dr. Mary Sanders
In the 4th part of our Case Files series on Rady Children’s, Andrea and Dr. Mary Sanders from Stanford University deep dive into the emotional and legal complexities of child abuse cases. They unpack how surveillance in hospital settings—while potentially life-saving—raises big questions around privacy and consent. The conversation also explores the difficult dynamics of teenage victims, how hard
Case Files 19: Rady Children's Part 3
We left off in the previous episode with Madison Meyer being returned to her parents after more than a year in state custody—yet still hospitalized at Rady Children’s Hospital in San Diego. Today, Andrea and Bex unpack the complaint filed by her parents in 2021 and Madison’s own 2024 lawsuit.
*please note that this episode contains mentions of suicide and sexual assault of a minor.
For resourc
S03 Ep07 RERUN: Trial of the Century
We're rereleasing an episode from our original coverage of the Kowalski case that was published on 11/7/2023.
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With a verdict in the case days away, host Andrea Dunlop unpacks some of what’s happened so far in the Kowalski v Johns Hopkins All Childrens trial with lawyer and trial consultant Jonathan Leach. They analyze the dueling opening statements, consider what each side is likely to look
Case Files 18: Rady Children’s Part 2
In part two of our series on the lawsuit against Rady Children’s Hospital in San Diego, Andrea and Dr. Bex continue unpacking the story of Madison Meyer, whose medical journey led to a separation from her parents. After video surveillance at Rady’s starts, a series of escalating concerns, reports to child protective services, and ultimately, a court order removing her from parental custody follows
Case Files 17: Rady Children’s Part 1
In the first part of our four part Case Files series diving into the upcoming lawsuit against Rady Children’s in San Diego, Andrea and Dr. Bex start with looking into preteen Madison Meyer’s string of diagnoses like Ehlers-Danlos syndrome, POTS, CRPS, and more. They break down what these conditions are and why they - coupled with Madison’s rapid decline - raised red flags.
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This podcast is
Case Files 16: Mom and Dad
In season 5, we shared a bit of Andrea’s conversation with her parents, and we’re releasing even more in this episode of case files. If you’ve been with us from the beginning, you’re familiar with Andrea’s sister's case. Today we hear from Megan and Andrea’s parents as they reflect on their experiences and share their hopes for their grandchildren.
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Listen to the NSBM episodes about Megan:
Case Files 15: Everyday Cults with Rachel Bernstein
In this week’s episode of Case Files, we’re joined by Rachel Bernstein, a therapist specializing in cults and the host of the podcast IndoctriNation. Andrea and Rachel delve into the crossover between those in the sphere of Munchausen by Proxy perpetrators and cults. Rachel talks about the complexity of cult dynamics, the emotional and psychological impacts on families, and the challenges faced by
Case Files 14: Susan Smith and the Impact of False Accusations with Celisia Stanton
In this episode, Andrea is joined by Celisia Stanton, the host and creator of Truer Crime. Andrea and Celisia dive into the Susan Smith case, a story that garnered national attention in the 90s. Through talking about the case, they segue into the complex themes surrounding false accusations, media representation, racial bias, mental health, and the nature of violence. Andrea and Celisia discuss th
Case Files 13: The Andreas of Ethical True Crime with Andrea Gunning
This week, our Andrea is joined by Andrea Gunning, host of the podcast Betrayal and There and Gone: South Street. Gunning speaks on her transition from television to podcasting. They both discuss the ethical consideration of the real-world consequences of sharing true crime stories, as well as the emotional weight of telling these stories with care. Gunning and Dunlop reflect on the healing power
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