
The Education of a Value Investor
This podcast documents Guy Spier's ongoing quest for wealth, wisdom and enlightenment. Episodes vary in length, featuring conversations with interesting people willing to be recorded, as well as short snippets of Spier's own thoughts. The show explores topics related to value investing and personal growth.
Episodes
My first clinical Trial: 5-ALA & Glioblastoma re-irradiation
For the first time, investor Guy Spier steps outside the world of finance to share a deeply personal conversation—with the doctors who treated him.
Recorded at the University Hospital Münster, this discussion with neurosurgeon Dr. Michael Müther and radiation oncologist Dr. Niklas Pepper explores the frontiers of brain cancer treatment, focusing on glioblastoma and a groundbreaking clinical tria
From Data Overload to Data Impact with Ritavan
In this episode, Guy Spier speaks with Ritavan and Paaras about how businesses can unlock real value through data—not by chasing trends like AI or cloud, but by leveraging data purposefully. Ritavan shares insights from his book Data Impact, discussing how legacy companies often fall into the trap of tech commoditization.Learn how to:Use data leverage for outsized returnsPrioritize high-impact “le
Uncertainty and Enterprise: A conversation with Amar Bhidé
What happens when a thoughtful investor sits down with a contrarian academic for a free-flowing, two-hour conversation? In this wide-ranging episode, Guy Spier reconnects with his former professor, Amar Bhidé, who’s the Professor of Health Policy at Columbia University Medical Center, for a dialogue that blurs the lines between economics, storytelling, philosophy, and life itself. They begin by re
Asset Liability Management & Interest Rate Risk in the Banking Book - Part 4 of 4
In this conversation between Guy Spier and Eric Schaanning, the discussion revolves around the intricacies of asset-liability management (ALM) and interest rate risk, particularly in the banking sector. Eric shares insights from his experience, explaining key concepts like the economic value of equity (EVE), DV01 (the sensitivity of a bank's net present value to interest rate changes), and various
Think smarter, not harder with Howard Marks
In this engaging podcast, Howard Marks, co-founder of Oaktree Capital, and Guy Spier, founder of Aquamarine Capital, share invaluable investment wisdom with Roi Lipovetzky, a former MBA student and current investment professional at Oakmount Capital.The conversation explores key principles of successful investing, such as mastering market cycles, second-level thinking, risk management, and the imp
Asset Liability Management & Interest Rate Risk in the Banking Book - Part 3 of 4
In this gripping segment, Eric Schaanning and Guy Spier delve into the complex world of interest rate risk, revealing how seemingly straightforward banking practices can quickly turn into high-stakes dilemmas. Schaanning breaks down how banks forecast deposit behaviours, merging historical trends with expert judgment. He explains that as interest rates fluctuate, customer preferences shift dramati
Asset Liability Management & Interest Rate Risk in the Banking Book - Part 2 of 4
In this episode, we continue our exploration of financial risk management with Eric Schaanning, a thought leader in the field. Following his dynamic insights from the previous discussion, Eric delves into the intricacies of treasury functions within major banks and their critical role in risk management. Together with Guy Spier, they unravel how a small treasury team, despite its size, manages sig
Asset Liability Management & Interest Rate Risk in the Banking Book - Part 1 of 4
Eric Schaanning is a dynamic figure in financial risk management, known for his innovative approach to navigating the complexities of market and valuation risk. Leading these critical functions for Nordea Group, Eric blends a wealth of experience with a forward-thinking mindset. His career spans impressive roles, including overseeing risk management for UBS and Credit Suisse in Zurich, where he de
Building a Framework for Business Quality with Simon Kold
Simon Kold is a Danish entrepreneur and investor who’s making waves in the financial world with his firm, Kold Investments. Before founding Kold Investments, Simon spent over a decadeatNovo Holdings, a powerhouse investment firm managing around €150billionin assets. His approach to investing is anything but ordinary. Simon runs a single-strategy, concentrated public equityfirm that focuses on comp
Building a Robust Investment Strategy: Insights from Tobias Carlisle
Tobias Carlisle, an Australian investor and founder of Acquirers Funds, LLC, also shares his personal journey—from his beginnings as a corporate advisory lawyer in Australia to his transition into investing inspired by Warren Buffett. His career spans roles as an activist hedge fund analyst and general counsel, leading up to his authorship of Deep Value, Quantitative Value, and Concentrated Invest
Jo Boaler on a visual approach to math, the illusion of knowledge, and differences between UK and US
Jo Boaler is a British author and Professor of Mathematics Education at Stanford University. Jo is involved in promoting reform mathematics and equitable mathematics classrooms, and thereby fulfils a role of communicating to broader society outside of academics. Beside her new book Math-ish, she is also the author of the books Limitless Mind, The Elephant in the Classroom and other books on learni
Morgan Housel – Selfish Writing, Fiction vs. Nonfiction, Methods for Connecting Ideas
Morgan Housel is the New York Times Bestselling author of The Psychology of Money and Same as Ever and a popular finance blogger. His books have sold over 4.5 million copies and have been translated into more than 50 languages. He is also a partner at The Collaborative Fund and serves on the board of directors at Markel. He talks to Guy Spier about the concept of writing for oneself, the slow way
Luca Dellanna on his book Ergodicity, autism, and decision making in our brains.
Luca Dellanna is a management advisor and an author from Turin, Italy. His books cover topics ranging across management, human behavior, and economics. He talks to Guy Spier about his early career, his research on ergodicity and some topics from his other books, including autism and the difference of decision making and action taking in our brains.Full transcript available here: https://aqfd.docse
Daniel Simons and Christopher Chabris on their book, social pressure, manifesting, and chess
Daniel Simons and Christopher Chabris are professors of psychology, both experts in the fields of cognitive science and experimental psychology. They are also known as the co-authors of the famous book The Invisible Gorilla, and the inventors of the homonymous psychological experiment. 12 years from the release of their first book they have partnered again, co-writing Nobody's Fool: Why We Get Tak
Ben Feder on Video Games, Artificial Intelligence and his VC Firm TIRTA
Ben Feder is an investor and games executive, currently managing partner at TIRTA Ventures. He is also the author of the book Take Off Your Shoes: One Man's Journey from the Boardroom to Bali and Back. Ben formerly served as the CEO of Take-Two Interactive and was President of International Partnerships for North America at Tencent Games.Ben talks to Guy about his early career in the media industr
Christina Patterson on Facing Adversity and Finding Strength
Christina Patterson is a journalist, writer, broadcaster, and coach. A former columnist at The Independent, today Christina writes for the Daily Mail, Observer Magazine and The Telegraph, and reviews for The Sunday Times. She is also a regular guest on the Sky News press preview. Christina talks to Guy Spier about her books and the journey of her and her family’s life, which effectively inspired t
Lauren Templeton on her Path in Investing, on Becoming Director of Fairfax India and on Working with her Husband
Lauren Templeton is the founder and CEO of Templeton & Phillips Capital Management. Investing runs in Lauren's blood, as she is the great niece of Sir John Templeton. She reflects on their work together, as well as on the impact of her father on Lauren's journey in investing. Lauren also gives some insight into the perks of working with her husband, Scott Phillips.Transcript available here: https:
William Green with Guy Spier: Investing Prudently in Perilous Times.
This is a repost of episode RWH023 of The Investor’s Podcast Network. Please check out the original episode here: https://youtu.be/G1yQcykKYJg If you’d like to hear more of William Green’s interviews on the “Richer, Wiser, Happier” podcast, then please check them out here: https://www.theinvestorspodcast.com/richer-wiser-happier/ We discussed many things that are so relevant to today's environ
Jeff Henriksen: Learning by Teaching. Gaining the Behavioral Edge in Investing
Jeff Henriksen is the co-founder and CEO of Thorpe Abbotts Capital, a value oriented hedge fund based in Charlottesville, Virginia. In this short interview, Jeff talks about his experience of attending the executive MBA programme in Oxford, leading to him staying to teach a valuation course to graduates. Other topics include gaining a behavioral edge in investing, and the advantages of a price to
Sachin Khajuria on His Book, Private Equity, Distressed Investing and Multicultural Backgrounds
Sachin Khajuria is an investor and the author of the book “Two and Twenty: How the Masters of Private Equity Always Win”. He holds two degrees in Economics from the University of Cambridge.Sachin talks to Guy Spier about his education, career, and the characteristics and future of the private equity world. He also touches on topics such as distressed investing, fee structures, and the importance o
Michael McCloskey - His journey to become a value investor, Visa and the whole credit cards industry
Michael McCloskey is the founder and president of GreensKeeper Asset Management. He is one of those rare-to-find people who has a flair for both numbers and writing. In fact, he has a BSc in mathematics, as well as both a JD and an MBA degree. Michael has worked as an investment banker and has a lot of experience in the securities industry. Today, he lives in Mississauga, Canada with his wife and
Milo Jones - Intelligence Failures, OODA-Loops, the Influence of Digital Tech on Society and the War
Milo Jones is political scientist, a business school professor focusing on intelligence analysis and geopolitics, and has served as an officer in the US Marine Corps. He is currently based in Warsaw, Poland, but he spends plenty of time travelling around the world. Milo is also the author of the book Constructing Cassandra: Reframing Intelligence Failure at the CIA, 1947-2001. He talks to Guy Spie
John Zolidis - About what made him found his company, the retail sector and physical stores vs Amazon
John Zolidis is an equity analyst and a registered investment advisor, President, and Founder of Quo Vadis Capital Inc. He talks to Guy Spier about what made him found his own company, about the retail sector, and the battle between physical stores and Amazon. John also shares why he is fascinated with the Chinese market, as well as gives some insight into a company he has been following. Full tra
Günther Dobrauz – Regulatory law in Switzerland, Blockchain technology and circular economy
Guenther Dobrauz is a half-Swiss, half-Austrian lawyer, Leader of PwC Legal Switzerland, and a member of PwC’s Global Legal Leadership Team. In the past he has co-run one of the first Swiss venture funds. He is also the author of 10 books.He talks to Guy Spier about regulatory law in Switzerland, his work at PwC, and his Austrian origins. Blockchain technology and circular economy are two of the m
Francisco Negrin – His early life, career in opera, and business leadership behind the scenes
Francisco Negrin is a creative director working in opera, as well as shows and other events.He talks to Guy Spier about his early life, his career in opera and the meaning of his sets, as well as the business leadership that is part of his work behind the scenes. Contents:(00:00:00) The Early Life of Francisco Negrin(00:16:06) Blending into Cultures(00:27:51) The Relevance of Opera(00:36:45) Tool
Mark Bitz - Winning Practices, Cultural Council, International Affairs and an honest rule of law
Mark Bitz is an entrepreneur, author and community leader. In his latest book, Winning Practices of a Free, Fit, and Prosperous People, and in his course, his aim is to make people aware of the essential practices that should flow through populations, be mastered and subsequently transmitted in order to evolve a superior set of software that enables them to really flourish in their environment.He
Ninad Shinde on lab-on-a-chip devices, evolution of private equity space and the cloud business
Ninad Shinde grew up in India, studied and worked in the United States, before moving to London, where he still lives and works as a consultant to private equity firms.He talks to Guy Spier about his education, his work on lab-on-a-chip devices, about the evolution of the private equity space and about one of his big interests, the cloud / software as a service business. You can find the talk by
Olaf Hein - His early life and education and the evolution of his career in the financial industry
Olaf Hein is the CEO of Elbstein AG, a publicly traded German holding company. He talks to Georgina Godwin about his early life and education and the evolution of his career in the financial industry. Mr. Hein also shares some advice based on his decades-long stock market experience.Here's an interview by Smart Investor who interviewed Olaf Hein about real estate shares and interesting niches with
David Sumpter: Applications of mathematics in practical areas of our day-to-day life
David Sumpter is a professor of applied mathematics at the University of Uppsala, in Sweden, and the author of a wonderful book called The 10 equations that Rule the World.He talks to Guy Spier about the various applications of mathematics in practical areas of our day-to-day life, such as social media algorithms, graph theory, Bayes’ theorem, and even vaccinations. Full transcript available her
Ricardo Fernandez: Investing in Private Equity in Brazil
Ricardo Fernandez is the Founder and Managing Partner of Signal Capital, an alternative asset management company. He grew up in Brazil, studied in Spain and in the United States, and holds an MBA from IESE and an AMP from Harvard Business School. Mr. Fernandez talks to Guy Spier about his education, career, and gives an inside look at the opportunities and life in Brazil.Full transcript available
Arthur Fine and Georgina Godwin: Aloha Medical Mission and the Power of Volunteers
Arthur Fine is a lawyer and one of the directors of Aloha Medical Mission (“AMM”), a non-profit volunteer organization based in Honolulu, Hawaii, which provides free health care to underserved people in the Pacific, Asia and Hawaii and does surgical missions in the developing world (alohamedicalmission.org). His wife, Marjorie Fine, is a general surgeon and a volunteer at AMM.Mr. Fine talks to Geo
Lory Spier on how to raise great children, the Dragon School and Growing up in Mexico
A few months ago, Lory Spier was invited to give the prize-giving-day speech to graduating students at the Dragon School in Oxford. In this interview, she talks to Georgina Godwin about growing up in Mexico, her working experiences and life in her twenties, as well as meeting Guy and eventually settling down in New York. At the end of the episode, Lory reads out the speech that she gave at the Dra
Gautam Baid: Important Lessons on Compounding and on Pursuing Your Passion
Gautam Baid, CFA, is the author of the international best-seller The Joys of Compounding. He is also the Founding Creator at Chapter, a revolutionary learning platform. Previously, Gautam served as a portfolio manager at an SEC-registered investment advisor based in Salt Lake City, Utah.Mr. Baid talks to me about growing up in India, moving to the United States, changing careers, and how he found
Manos Papatheofanous on the Canadian Pension Plan, Inflation and Cryptocurrencies
Manos Papatheofanous was born and raised in Greece, before moving to London to study computer science 31 years ago. Throughout his career he has worked various jobs in banks and proprietary trading desks, in asset management firms and in hedge funds, and has also completed a degree from London Business School of Master’s in Finance. Two years ago, Mr. Papatheofanous joined CPP Investments, the inv
Margaret Van and Georgina Godwin: The Practice of Mindfulness
Margaret Van was born in a Shanghainese family in Hong Kong. From early on, she has had a deep interest in other cultures, which has also led her to learn various languages with the main goal of being able to communicate with people from all over the world. Since 2005, Ms. Van has embarked on a new chapter as she discovered the practice of mindfulness. She is now a certified teacher and continues
Vanessa Stelling and Georgina Godwin: The Journey of Raising an Autistic Son
Vanessa Stelling is the author of the book Julian and I: A Mother’s Journey Through Regressive Autism, a deeply personal narration of the fears, the struggles and the evolution that she went through by raising her autistic son. She talks to Georgina Godwin about the book, about her journey with Julian and about where they are in their lives today. Full transcript available here: https://aqfd.docse
William Oliver & William Barnes on the Primary Research Industry and their Company, In Practise
In this episode, Guy Spier talks to William Oliver and William Barnes, the founders of In Practise, a research network with a slightly different business model compared to other companies in the primary research business. They give valuable insights on the primary research industry and on topics such as how to conduct high-quality conversations and what part of management to interview when researc
Jackie Shoback on Financial Services and the Future of Digital Identity
Jackie Shoback is a Harvard graduate who has spent the last 25 years of her career as general manager and C-suite executive, with a lot of experience in launching, scaling and growing businesses from startup up through multiple billion dollars. She talks to Guy Spier about co-founding her new venture firm, balancing family and a professional career and the future of digital identity.Full transcrip
Adam Mead on the Research Behind His Book, The Complete Financial History of Berkshire Hathaway
Adam Mead is a practicing capital allocator, the CEO and Chief Investment Officer of Mead Capital Management, an investment management business he founded in 2014. He recently published a book, The Complete Financial History of Berkshire Hathaway: A Chronological Analysis of Warren Buffett and Charlie Munger's Conglomerate Masterpiece, which provides a comprehensive and detailed history of Berkshi
Brian Murray: Lessons on Class Actions, Contingency Lawyers and Arbitration Clauses
Brian Murray is a partner in Glancy Prongay & Murray, a class action litigation firm with offices in New York and Los Angeles. He talks to me about contingency lawyers, Robinhood and the history and importance of arbitration clauses. Full transcript available here: https://aqfd.docsend.com/view/erfj4tazu4zf7qpz Contents: The Benefits of Working with Contingency Lawyers (00:00)Class Actions and Mas
Yishai Kiczales on Classic Books and Movies and the Future of Cinema
Yishai Kiczales is an Israeli film critic, songwriter and lecturer, who currently lives in Zurich with his family. He writes for the daily newspaper Israel Hayom, and his third solo album, "Inside Yishai Kiczales", will be released on May 22. He talks to me about classic books and movies, about the recent changes in the world of cinema, and highlights some things the streaming services are missing
William Green on the Journey of Becoming a Writer and the Rewards of Being a Mensch
William Green talks to Guy Spier about his new book, Richer, Wiser, Happier. He shares the long journey he has been on, before finally reaching the confidence and courage to publish his own book, which is full of insights from extraordinary people on how to think better, invest better and live more wisely. Mr. Green believes in compounding goodwill and does not hold back from sharing with the list
Philippe Taieb on His Life and Career, The Non-Profit Economy and the Future of Politics in France
Georgina Godwin interviews Philippe Taieb, an accomplished and respected consultant and coach with a unique experience of working both in the corporate world as a consultant at Braxton Associates, a strategy consulting firm, and in the social impact sector, for The Nature Conservancy, the world’s largest environmental non profit, a role he was recruited for from Harvard Business School. Philippe d
Jeremy Deal on Hamilton Helmer’s Book, 7 Powers, and Investment Research
In this episode, Guy Spier and Jeremy Deal speak about Hamilton Helmer’s Seven Powers and how Deal uses the framework in his own investment research as well as some of the major takeaways from this research. Finally, they discuss LinkedIn usage, informational podcasts and CEOs they both admire.Full transcript available here: https://aqfd.docsend.com/view/agr4ggjf2rsuijbuContents:Transitioning to E
Jehangir Appoo and Georgina Godwin: From Cardiothoracic Surgery to AOIT Health
Georgina Godwin interviews Jehangir Appoo, an incredibly accomplished cardiothoracic surgeon. Among his accolades, are two fellowships, the first from the Royal Brompton Hospital, Imperial College, London and the second from the University of Pennsylvania. He has also held the position of Clinical Associate Professor of Cardiac Surgery at the University of Calgary, helping establish an artificial
Grant Schreiber and Georgina Godwin: Growing Up in South Africa and the Real Leaders Magazine
In this conversation Grant Schreiber talks to Georgina Godwin about growing up in South Africa, his books, Real Leaders magazine and his future plans.Full transcript available here: https://aqfd.docsend.com/view/7xek49puhrabuxsqContents:Early Life and Education under Apartheid (01:51)Business Regulations in South Africa (06:51)The Books: Healing Through Humour (09:03)Becoming Global Citizens (11:0
Joe Chapman
In this conversation, Joe Chapman talks to me about his squash career, Chapman Property Group and master-planned communities. University of Rochesterwww.rochester.edu/ Michael Rizzo http://www.sas.rochester.edu/eco/people/faculty/rizzo_michael/index.html Journal Monetary Economicswww.journals.elsevier.com/journal-of-monetary-economics Wikipedia Pagehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Chapman BVI Oly
Amanda Pullinger and Georgina Godwin: The Importance of Women in Finance
In this call Georgina Godwin and Amanda Pullinger discuss the advantages of having a diverse workplace, and the opportunities presented by having more women take leading roles in finance. Amanda Pullinger, CEO of 100 Women in Finance, uses her experience to predict what proportion women will make up the finance sector by 2030.Full transcript available here: https://aqfd.docsend.com/view/cjy2hevj6j
Georgina Godwin Introduction by Guy Spier
Introducing Georgina Godwin - who will be doing some of the interviews and hosting. In this episode Guy Spier interviews Georgina Godwin, who will conduct some of the interviews going forward. She discusses her start as a radio host, working at Monocle, and the importance of asking about interviewees early influences.More about Georgina Godwin here:HTTP://www.twitter.com/georginagodwinOr find her
Email Update: Knowledge Management in a New Era
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Email Update: Knowledge Management in a New Era by Guy Spier is licensed under a Creative Commons License.
Kevin Schawinski: Supermassive Black Holes, the Big Bang, Quantum Mechanics, Artificial Intelligence
In this conversation Kevin Schawinski talks to me about galaxies’ transition process, quantum mechanics and machine learning. He also goes into detail about his Galaxy Zoo citizen science project and about Modulos.Other relevant links here: https://twitter.com/kevinschawinski ch.linkedin.com/in/kevin-schawinski-517b2a74 de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Schawinski https://skyandtelescope.org/sky-and
Aaron Edelheit: Twitter, the Sabbath, US Real Estate and Chick-fil-a
In this conversation Aaron Edelheit and I talk about modern approaches to value investing, Twitter, his book and American home. Full transcript available here: https://aqfd.docsend.com/view/gu8jh94rj4cemuu5Contents:Modern Approaches To Value Investing (00:41)Twitter as a Curation Tool (03:15)Twitter: The Teenage Years (16:47)Expanding the Twitter Ecosystem (19:43)Jack-of-All-Trades Investors (33:
Eitan Chitayat on His Viral Video and People Who Inspire Him
Eitan Chitayat leads Natie, a creative branding agency based in Tel Aviv. I originally met Eitan at the founding of the Entrepreneurs Organization chapter in Tel Aviv. When it comes to branding, he's a creative genius. He's also the author of the extraordinary "I'm that Jew" viral youtube video that got more than 10 million hits on various social channelsI'm that JewEitan on twitterNatieBlog Post
Discussing the 2020 Berkshire Hathaway Annual General Meeting with Dante Albertini
I got together with my friend Dante Albertini of Omaha Capital and a group of Peruvian investors to discuss our impressions of the 2020 Berkshire Hathaway Annual General Meeting. We also discussed the world economy, the state of the markets, and coronavirus.More about Dante Albertini here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dante-albertini-8387491/?originalSubdomain=peFull transcript available here: http
Herman Peterscheck: How to break into the Gaming Industry, Tencent, Warhammer and Disney.
Hermann Peterscheck used to make games at a company called Riot. Now he manages Hypernormal Capital which involves a lot of reading, some writing and the occasional investment decision.hypernormalcapital.com/www.linkedin.com/in/hermannpeterschecktwitter.com/petershk Q3 Letter to PartnersHe is my go-to expert in the gaming industry. We talked about Nintendo, League of Legends, Games Workshop, Tence
Matthew Peterson: Is now the time to Invest?
Is now the time to invest? That's the question that I asked Matthew Peterson. The Covid-19 pandemic is raging. Countries are locked down, shelter-in-place orders have been issued, and market prices have collapsed with unprecedented volatility. Guy poses on the record questions and Matthew shares a rare message with all investors not to miss this opportunity.Matthew Peterson is the managing par
Marcelo Lima - Opening up after Coronavirus
In this conversation, I talk to Marcelo Lima who is the CEO of Heller House Capital management about how we should open up in the aftermath of coronavirus.Full episode summary here: https://www.guyspier.com/conversation-with-marcelo-lima-on-coronavirus/or PDF here: https://aqfd.docsend.com/view/x75c8hw26i6v6s74Contents:Marcelo on flipping the economy switch to “On” (05:28)Tracking the COVID-19 tr
Email Update April 2020
Email Update April 2020 by Guy Spier
Naama Baram of Teva Pharmaceuticals
This conversation was with Naama Baram - who is the General Manager of Teva Pharmaceuticals in Switzerland.Full transcript available here: https://aqfd.docsend.com/view/agf6a952mbzupdb9Teva and the Pharma Industryhttps://tevapharm.com/https://twitter.com/bnaamahttps://www.linkedin.com/in/naama-bar-am/https://www.instagram.com/p/BbZqLWpB4OF/?igshid=53huznuez7iMeditationhttps://plumvillage.org/about
Camilla Cavendish on Brexit and the Pleasure of Writing
Introduction, Camilla Cavendish My conversation with Camilla Cavendish took place before the coronavirus – and hence in another world. Yet despite reminding us of cherished, past habits like routine trans-Atlantic travel – resident in London, she is a fellow at Harvard, and normally flies over every six weeks – the discussion was remarkably prescient. This should not be surprising: Camilla is a hi
Diana Wais on the Real World Applications of Her "Emotional Laws" Concept
I have known Diana Wais for more than 20 years. If I had not met Diana, I would not have met my wife, Lory. And even if I had met Lory, without Diana's help and counselling, we would not have stayed married - I am sure.This was my first stab at a podcast - and was recorded more than two years ago - i.e. in 2018 or before.In this call, Guy Spier interviews Diana Wais to understand the real-world ap
Warren Buffett's 2015 Annual Letter
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