Trust Me: Cults, Extreme Belief, and Manipulation
Trust Me is a weekly interview podcast about cults, extreme belief, and the fine line between devotion and delusion, told through firsthand accounts from survivors. Hosted by Lola Blanc and Meagan Elizabeth, who have both been in cults themselves, the show features guests from groups like Heaven's Gate, the Manson Family, NXIVM, and OneTaste. Each episode combines personal stories with expert insights into seductive leaders, organized religion, and the psychology of influence. The podcast approaches the topic with unfiltered honesty, dark humor, and compassion, exploring what it means to believe, belong, and break free.
Episodes
Maria Bamford - 12 Step Programs, OCD, and How to Join Every Group
This week, Lola and Meagan are joined by comic, actor, and author of Sure I’ll Join Your Cult, Maria Bamford. The girls discuss Maria’s childhood OCD, intrusive thoughts, and the ways those experiences primed her to seek support, structure, and belonging through a variety of groups later in life. They explore culty (but helpful!) aspects of 12 step programs like Debtors Anonymous and A
Sarah Edmondson, Part 2 - DOS, Disillusionment, and Leaving Keith Raniere
This week is part 2 with Sarah Edmondson, NXIVM survivor, author, and host of A Little Bit Culty. The girls pick back up as Sarah goes deeper into the organization, eventually entering DOS and confronting the growing contradictions inside NXIVM. She’ll discuss the emotional grip of the group, the normalization of control, and the psychological unraveling that be
Sarah Edmondson, Part 1 - Joining NXIVM, Meeting Keith Raniere, and Moving Up the Ranks
This week is part 1 with, at long last, Sarah Edmondson, NXIVM survivor, author, and host of A Little Bit Culty, a podcast and now book, co-hosted and authored with her husband, Nippy Ames. She’ll tell the girls how she first joined the self-help group—which turned out to be a sex cult—starting with a comment by Mark Vicente that shook her worldview. She’ll discuss why she
Nomzia Bistline, Part 2 - Raided by the FBI, Life in Prison, and Breaking Free From Sam Bateman
In part 2 with Nomzia aka Nomz Bistline, from Netflix’s docuseries Trust Me: The False Prophet (with Lola’s mom), Nomz shares what it was like getting raided by the FBI, how she felt about Lola’s mom when she learned Christine was the FBI informant, and why the “prophet” Samuel Bateman was obsessed with marrying the queen of England.She discusses the events leading up
Nomzia Bistline, Part 1 - The False Prophet: Growing Up FLDS & Marrying Sam Bateman
This week is part one with Nomzia “Nomz” Bistline, from the Netflix docuseries Trust Me: The False Prophet (with Lola’s mom, Christine!). Nomz joins the girls to talk about what it was like growing up in polygamist group the FLDS after leader Warren Jeffs went to prison, how she was raised in poverty and taught to be paranoid about the outside world, and how many of the fathers i
Lyndsey Burr - Producing America’s Next Top Model
Lyndsey Burr, longtime reality television producer who worked on America’s Next Top Model for years, joins the girls to talk about her experiences working on the now-controversial hit show. She talks about what the team looked for when casting, some of the more problematic challenges the show used, and the time she lost the models in Thailand. They discuss how it was the wild west of reality
Matthew Remski, Part 2 - Cult Hopping, Disillusionment, and Root Causes of Cults
In part two with Matthew Remski (author and host of the Conspirituality podcast), Matthew shares how he cult hopped from his first guru to his second, the moment that disillusioned him, and the cultural patterns he's seeing—including a resurgence of the Satanic panic—that most alarm him as he follows conspiracies and spirituality on his podcast.He’ll talk about how the importance
Matthew Remski, Part 1 - Seizures, Spirituality, & the First Charismatic Guru
This week’s guest is Matthew Remski, author and host of the Conspirituality podcast. In part one, he talks about his own personal experiences with gurus and cultic dynamics, and what led him to the topic of cults and conspiracies. He tells the girls about his own religious upbringing, the mysterious seizures that led to his fascination with spirituality, and what drew him to his first charis
Harrison Hill - The Aggressive Christianity Missions Training Corps
Author Harrison Hill joins the girls to discuss his new book The Oracle’s Daughter, which follows the rise and fall of a small cult called the Aggressive Christianity Missions Training Corps. He explains what the religious landscape in America looked like at the time, with the spiritual awakening and unrest of the 60s transitioning into a new Christianity movement, and how this group&rs
Celeste Gross - Growing Up in the Children of God
Celeste Gross joins the girls to talk about her experiences growing up in the Children of God - aka the Family - along with her many siblings. She explains how her parents joined when it still just seemed like a beautiful gospel movement that helped her dad get sober, but how it changed over time once they lived on a commune in Brazil and became reliant on donations for survival. She shares how ev
Dan Olson, Part 2 - Charismatic Leaders and the Cult of Crypto
This week, Dan Olson, creator and host of YouTube channel Folding Ideas, returns to continue the conversation on cryptocurrency and NFTs. They discuss how these bubbles are driven primarily by charismatic leaders, why success rates of investment are similar to MLMs (read: the vast majority of investors don’t win big), and how there’s a lot of shame around having lost money in this
Dan Olson, Part 1 - Crypto, NFTs, and Tech’s War on Doubt
This week, Dan Olson of the YouTube channel Folding Ideas joins the show for a deep dive into crypto, NFTs, and why so many of these spaces start to feel less like finance and more like belief systems. He breaks down the history of Bitcoin, what cryptocurrencies actually are, and how NFTs exploded into the mainstream, with investor communities promising not just wealth, but destiny–as long a
Liz Cameron, Part 2 - Christ is on Earth, He’s in Prison, and You’re His Bride
This week is part two with Liz Cameron, author of Cult Bride and survivor of Korean religious group Jesus Morning Star, also known as JMS. Last week she discussed the slow process of indoctrination into the group, and this week Liz shares how she learned the community's deepest secret: the mysterious Pastor Joshua was actually named Jung Myung-seok, but he was REALLY the Second Coming of Jesus. An
Liz Cameron, Part 1 - Jesus Morning Star aka JMS: A Bookstore, a Bible Study Group, and a Prophet on Earth
This week is part one with Liz Cameron, survivor of South Korean religious sect Jesus Morning Star (aka JMS, aka Providence), and author of Cult Bride: How I Was Brainwashed – and How I Broke Free. She explains how her entry into JMS began with being approached by a woman in a bookstore for a harmless survey, and how that survey turned into a bible study group full of women who gained her tr
Martina Castro, Part 2 - Allegations, Disappearances, and the Crumbling Cult of John of God
This week we’re back with Martina Castro, creator of new Exactly Right podcast Two Faced: John of God, a series about John of God, the famous Brazilian “healer” and “psychic surgeon.” Last week she explained John of God’s so-called healings and doctor spirits that attracted celebrities and visitors from all over the world, and this week Martina walks Lola &
Martina Castro, Part 1 - Psychic Surgeries & John of God's Spiritual Celebrity
This week’s guest is Martina Castro, creator of podcast Two Faced: John of God, Exactly Right’s new podcast series about John of God, the Brazilian self-proclaimed healer and “psychic surgeon.” In part one, Martina explains John of God’s history and mythology, how he became internationally famous for his alleged healings (amplified by celebrities like Oprah), and the
Parvati Shallow - From Surviving a Cult to Winning Survivor
This week, the show is joined by Parvati Shallow, two-time Survivor winner, current cast member on The Traitors, and author of Nice Girls Don’t Win: How I Burned it All Down to Claim My Power. Parvati shares about her childhood growing up in the Kashi Ashram, a high-control commune led by Joyce Green–or, as she made everyone call her, “Ma”. She discusses
Jenny Eliscu - Conservatorships & Freeing Britney Spears
This week’s guest is Jenny Eliscu, journalist, radio host, and producer on Britney vs. Spears, which covered Britney Spears’ infamous conservatorship. She explains how Britney’s struggles in 2008 were used to justify a permanent conservatorship—despite the contradiction of her being deemed too incapacitated to control her own life, yet well enough to tour, record, and gener
Jonathan Hirsch, Part 2 - Meditation, Getting Blessed, and Leaving Adidam
In part 2 with podcaster & writer Jonathan Hirsch (creator of podcasts like Dear Franklin Jones), Lola & Meagan discuss life in the cult of Franklin Jones, aka Adi Da. They discuss the dramatic meditation rituals in the group, what it felt like to get blessed by the leader, and how different members saw some of the same things that had happened completely differently, depending on whether
Jonathan Hirsch, Part 1 - A Guru, a Compound, and the Cult of Adi Da
This week’s guest is Jonathan Hirsch, podcaster, producer, and author who grew up in Adidam, a cult led by new age guru Franklin Jones - also known as Adi Da. In this week’s episode, Jonathan explains how his parents joined the group while on a spiritual journey that started with them following a different guru, how many of Jones’s followers were indoctrinated by listening to his
David Farrier - Conspiracies, Cults, and Investigating Arise Church
This week, Trust Me is joined by David Farrier, journalist and filmmaker known for documentaries like Tickled and Netflix series Dark Tourist. He shares about his work studying strange subcultures and conspiracy theorists and what he’s learned along the way, and then dives into his investigation into Arise Church, the largest megachurch in New Zealand.David explains how his interviews with e
Jess Rothschild - SoulCycle and the Cult of Spinning
This week’s guest is Jess Rothschild, creator of documentary podcast "Cult of Body & Soul," which dives into the history of cult fitness brand Soulcycle. She explains the spinning company's origins, how the workout environment was engineered to create an almost religious experience, and why instructors chosen for their devoted followings and special charisma made it a cultural phenomenon
REWIND: Elana Auerbach - OneTaste (aka the Orgasm Cult)
Episode 19: Lola Blanc & Meagan Elizabeth interview Elana Auerbach, former follower of sexual wellness company OneTaste--elsewhere deemed the Orgasm Cult--in its early years. Elana discusses being the founder's right hand woman as the program developed, and how the sexual practice involving stimulating a woman's genitals evolved into what's now called Orgasmic Meditation. They discuss how Elan
REWIND: Felicia Rosario and Daniel Levin - Stolen Youth: Inside the Cult at Sarah Lawrence
Survivor's of Larry Ray's sex cult Felicia and Daniel discuss how they came to meet Larry, how he leveraged his memory and connections to craft an image of authority, how Larry gained control of their lives under the guise of helping them, when the manipulation elevated into sexual abuse and violence, and how they're doing now that Larry is going to jail for the harm he has caused. See omnys
Theo Pratt - Blue Dresses, Smacking Ladies, and an Isolated Compound: Surviving Gloriavale
This week’s guest is Theo Pratt, survivor of Gloriavale, an isolated Christian cult hidden deep in rural New Zealand, and author of Unveiled: A Story of Surviving Gloriavale. She’ll talk about being raised on the strictly controlled commune where people were assigned new names, women wore identical dresses and head coverings, and children weren’t taught the real days of the week&
Renee DiResta - Part 2: Pseudo-Events, More on Disinformation, and Telling Fact From Fiction
Renee DiResta, professor and author of Invisible Rulers: The People Who Turn Lies Into Reality, joins the show again to dive deeper into disinformation, propaganda, and "pseudo-events," or manufactured controversies and news stories.She explains why it’s so difficult to tell fact from fiction online, how propagandists stoke real, often legitimate tensions to create division, how American pol
Renee DiResta - Part 1: Propaganda, Disinformation, and Bespoke Realities
This week’s guest is Renee DiResta, professor, and author of Invisible Rulers: The People Who Turn Lies Into Reality. In part one this week, she talks to Lola and Meagan about propaganda, disinformation vs. misinformation, and how social media algorithms push us all into highly individualized, “bespoke” realities.They discuss how she became interested in this topic after social m
Mike & Abbi Prussack – Part 2: Predators in Power, Institutional Denial, and the Fight to Expose It
This week, Lola and Meagan continue their conversation with Mike and Abbi Prussack, former members of Meagan’s childhood church, the 2x2s. In part 2, they walk the girls through the abuse crisis that has shaken the group in recent years and the long-standing patterns that allowed the harm to continue. Mike and Abbi explain how church leadership handled reports, why victims felt they had nowh
Mike & Abbi Prussack - Part 1: A Church with No Name, Isolated Childhoods, and Doomsday Fear
This week, Lola and Meagan talk with Mike and Abbi Prussack, former members of Meagan’s childhood church, the 2x2s, also known as The Truth or The Way. The couple, who now help moderate the Ex-2x2 Facebook community, share what it was like growing up in a secretive religious group with no name, no building, and strict rules about who could be “in.”They open up about meeting and m
Tim Squirrell - Incels, Redpill, and the Manosphere
This week, researcher Tim Squirrel joins Lola & Meagan to break down the manosphere: incels, redpill, MGTOW, and the differences between some of the misogynistic subcultures in the online world of men. They discuss how isolation can leave boys vulnerable to harmful internet communities, and how the algorithm can radicalize young people looking for identity.From Andrew Tate to Jordan
Sarma Melngailis - Part 2: Isolation, Deeper into the Scam, & Getting Arrested
In part 2, Sarma Melngailis, subject of the docuseries Bad Vegan and author of The Girl with the Duck Tattoo, tells Lola & Meagan how Mr. Fox consumed her time, overwhelmed her with information, and dangled promises of financial freedom that was always JUST around the corner as a way to get her to send him more and more money. She’ll share about the fabricated online personas he created
Sarma Melngailis - Part 1: Bad Vegan, Meeting Mr. Fox, and Early Red Flags
In part 1 with guest Sarma Melngailis, subject of the docuseries Bad Vegan and author of The Girl with the Duck Tattoo, Sarma shares about her life as the owner of a successful vegan restaurant in New York, how she met the man who called himself Mr. Fox on Twitter when he seemed to know her friend Alec Baldwin, her first impressions of Mr. Fox, and some of the initial red flags
Arabelle Sicardi - Plastic Surgery in Mormonism, Biohacking, and the Beauty Industry
This week, the girls are joined by Arabelle Sicardi, writer, image theorist, and author of The House of Beauty: Lessons from the Image Industry. Lola and Meagan confess the cosmetic procedures they've each had, and Arabelle explores how the beauty industry preys on our deepest fears, giving us a false sense of control and training us to worship ideals that are impossible to reach. They reflec
Anthony Cesar Duncan - ChatGPT Psychosis and the Dangers of AI
This week, the girls are joined by Anthony Cesar Duncan, an artist, mental health advocate, and survivor of ChatGPT psychosis. Anthony opens up about his descent into a psychotic episode, led by an unlikely new cult figure: ChatGPT. He describes how his episode began innocently enough, how the platform’s responses started to amplify his delusions and isolate him from his loved ones, and how
Aaron Goldenberg - Homeschool, Conversion Therapy, and Finally Coming Out
Aaron Goldenberg, actor, comedian, and (hilarious) content creator, joins Lola and Meagan to talk about being gay as a Christian child, what it was like learning Bill Gothard’s IBLP homeschool curriculum as a boy, and how his parents discovered his queerness and sent him to conversion therapy. He talks about Exodus International, a now-disbanded “ex-gay” Christian ministry that t
Sarah Stankorb - Quiverfull, Christian Nationalism, and Why Evangelical Women Are Leaving
Journalist Sarah Stankorb comes on the show to talk about her book, Disobedient Women, and the deep dive she did on why a series of evangelical women in America began to leave their communities as the internet came into prominence. They discuss patriarchal teachings within cultures like the Quiverfull movement, including stories like Vyckie Garrison’s, who was pressured into having repeated
Erika Lantz & Elin Lantz Lesser - Book Burnings, Rapture Drills, & the River Road Fellowship
Guests Erika Lantz and Elin Lantz Lesser join to discuss season 3 of their investigative podcast The Turning, which follows the journey of a young woman named Lindsay, a former member of a Christian group in Minnesota called River Road Fellowship. They talk about the background of the leader Victor Bernard, how Lindsay’s parents moved the family to the cult compound, and what it was like liv
Jane Borden - Cults Like Us: Puritans, Demagogues, and America’s Doomsday Obsession
Journalist Jane Borden joins the girls to discuss her book Cults Like Us, a gripping investigation into how cultic thinking is woven into the fabric of American life. Jane delves into the radical roots of early Protestant settlers, how the deep-rooted American mythology of a strong rebel cowboy who can save us from the bad guys makes us more susceptible to demagogues and authoritarians, and why pr
Megan Elizabeth Cox - The Remnant Fellowship, Gwen Shamblin, and the Worship of Skinny
Megan Elizabeth Cox–not to be confused with our Meagan Elizabeth–shares how she first started Gwen Shamblin’s weight loss program as a child, when her mom began listening to the cassette tapes in the 90s. She opens up about what it was like growing up in a family that was fixated on weight loss, how it felt meeting Shamblin, the high-haired woman behind the voice, and how the pro
Claire Hoffman - The Rise and Vanishing of Evangelist Megastar Aimee Semple McPherson
Journalist Claire Hoffman joins us again, this time to discuss her new book Sister, Sinner: the unbelievable true story of Aimee Semple McPherson, a glamorous Pentecostal preacher who pioneered entertainment evangelism. McPherson was so famous in the 1920s she could have been a Kardashian.Claire talks about how the early televangelist used theatrics and mass media to build an empire around her pre
Claire Hoffman - Levitation, Meditation, and a Childhood in a Transcendental Meditation Trailer Park
In Part 1 of our interview with journalist Claire Hoffman, Claire shares what it was like growing up in an Iowa trailer park community built around the Transcendental Meditation (or TM) movement and its charismatic leader, Maharishi Mahesh Yogi–whose followers included The Beatles. Claire shares what the daily routine was like in the TM community, how it felt believing every adult she knew c
Carol Merchasin - The Cult Assassin: Suing High-Control Groups
Attorney Carol Merchasin didn’t set out to expose cults, but after investigating allegations about a high-control Buddhist organization and discovering that the abuse had run more rampant than she’d imagined, she became a lawyer and focused her practice on getting justice for survivors of cults and abusive groups. Carol discusses the legal ins and outs of suing cults and spiritual lead
Akina Cox - Part 2: The Moonies, ICE, and the Cult Tactics of Trump
Artist and writer Akina Cox returns to share more about her experience growing up in the Unification Church (also known as the Moonies), its physical punishment rituals, and where the church stands now. The girls then transition from the topic of her particular cult to a discussion on the cult-like patterns of the current American political landscape, and how to approach political disagreements wi
Akina Cox - Part 1: Unification Church, Mass Weddings, and Unpaid Labor
Artist and writer Akina Cox shares about her childhood growing up in the Unification Church, also known as the Moonies. They discuss the background of the church and its late leader Reverend Moon, how her parents both joined after hitchhiking in the 70s, and what it was like growing up in the group. She shares how it felt participating in a mass wedding ceremony, moving to the border of North and
Introducing Trust Me: Cults, Extreme Belief, and Manipulation
Trust Me is the podcast that pulls back the curtain on cults, high-control groups and the psychology of belief. Hosted by cult survivors Lola Blanc and Meagan Elizabeth, the show features raw, first-hand accounts from people who’ve been manipulated, love-bombed and pulled into systems of control—and lived to tell the tale. Each week, Lola and Meagan talk to people who’ve escaped,
REWIND: Dianne Lake - The Manson Family, Part 1: Meeting Charlie
Trust Me has joined Exactly Right Media. Hosts Lola Blanc & Meagan Elizabeth will be back with new episodes on Wednesday, July 30th. You’re a teenage girl in the late 60s, bouncing between communes, when a charismatic man and his group of young women welcome you with open arms. You were looking for a family, and now you’ve found one. In part one of an incredible interview
REWIND: Glynn Washington - The Worldwide Church of God
Trust Me has joined Exactly Right Media. Hosts Lola Blanc & Meagan Elizabeth will be back with new episodes on Wednesday, July 30th. End time prophecies? Memorizing the bible? Required church vacations your family can't afford? Snap Judgment host and creator Glynn Washington shares his experiences growing up in the apocalyptic religion the Worldwide Church of God. He tells the girls
REWIND: Hoyt Richards - From Supermodel to Cult Member
Trust Me has joined Exactly Right Media. Hosts Lola Blanc & Meagan Elizabeth will be back with new episodes on Wednesday, July 30th. What do you model your life after? For producer, actor, and former supermodel Hoyt Richards, it was the teachings of a charming man from Nantucket who spoke about the impending apocalypse and a distant star named Arcturus. Hoyt share
REWIND: Lola's Mom - Mormon-Offshoot Cult
Trust Me has joined Exactly Right Media. Hosts Lola Blanc & Meagan Elizabeth will be back with new episodes on Wednesday, July 30th. In their first ever episode, Lola and Meagan interviewed Christine Marie, Lola's mom, about her and Lola's experiences believing in a self-proclaimed Mormon prophet. They discuss how they came to believe in him, their separation from each other, Christine's harro
An Exciting Update from Lola and Meagan!
The rumors are true—Trust Me is coming back this summer on the Exactly Right podcast network! This teaser has everything you need to know about our next chapter.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Amanda Rae - The Kingston Clan and Escaping Polygamy
Today our guest is Amanda Rae, host of YouTube channel by the same name and former member of the Kingston Clan, or the Order, a polygamist group in Utah, not to be confused with the FLDS. Some of you may remember our previous guest Priscilla from the same group - both of these gals were on Escaping Polygamy. Amanda’s going to tell us who the Kingstons are, how many mothers she had, and the princip
Maggie Rowe - Sinning Bravely and Moral Scrupulosity
Today our guest is Maggie Rowe, former writer on Arrested Development and author of Sin Bravely, a book about her experiences with moral scrupulosity, or sin-focused OCD. We talk a lot about OCD on this show, so here’s a guest who wrote an entire book about growing up with religious obsessions! She’ll tell us about her first obsessions about what was and was not sin, how she started to analyze the
Caleb Ward, Part 2 - Disneyland for Christians and Exiting the Church
Former evangelical Christian and pastor's son Caleb Ward continues his story of growing up in evangelical culture in the early 2000s. We discuss some of the touchstones of his youth including Heritage USA (Disneyland for Christians) and Christian rock event Creation Festival, as well as his fear of losing his virginity before marriage, what hell to meant to him (and Lola and Meagan) growing up, ho
Caleb Ward, Part 1 - Kingdom Life Ministries and Evangelical Youth Culture
Former pastor's son Caleb Ward joins Lola and Meagan to share his experience about the height of evangelical culture in the early 2000s in a church called Kingdom Life Ministries. Caleb discusses growing up in an environment where everyone was speaking in tongues and having loud prophecies in the middle of church, the pressures that come with being the son of a pastor, how heightened emotional exp
Uriah Wesman, Part 2 - Growing Up in Three Cults (The Hearts Center and The Ideal Society)
Today is part 2 with Uriah Wesman, former member of THREE different cults. This week he’ll talk to us more about cult #2, the Hearts Center (which was an offshoot of cult #1 from last week), what it was like being a rebellious emo kid slowly starting to realize inconsistencies in the church, and how his dad discovered cult #3 in Canada, the Ideal Society. We’ll talk about why he loved Canada so mu
Uriah Wesman, Part 1 - The First Cult: Church Universal and Triumphant
Creator of the one man show 3 Cults Walk Into a Bar, Uriah Wesman, shares about his FIRST cult experience in Church Universal and Triumphant, how they combined Christianity and New Age ideas, the paranoia that was created by beliefs surrounding demons, his mom's mental deterioration that led her to accuse his father of being a demon, and his parents split that led him to his next cult... which we'
Philip Deslippe & Stacie Stukin - 3HO,Kundalini yoga, & Yogi Bhajan
Today our guests are historian Philip Deslippe and writer Stacie Sutkin, who together have done investigative reporting on 3HO (“happy, healthy, holy organization”), Kundalini yoga, and Yogi Bhajan. They’re going to tell us how they got started writing about 3HO, both interacting with Kundalini yoga in different ways, who Yogi Bhajan was and whether he had any credibility in the Sikh religion (spo
REWIND: Frank Lyford - Heaven's Gate, Part 2: Breaking Away
Episode 23: Lola Blanc & Meagan Elizabeth continue to interview Frank Lyford, former member of Heaven's Gate. In part 2, they discuss the growing number of red flags he began to notice after one of the leaders died, including talk of castration, and what led to his decision to finally, after 18 years, break away. He also tells the girls what it was like when he heard about the mass suicide on
REWIND: Frank Lyford - Heaven's Gate, Part 1: The Nomadic Lifestyle
Episode 22: Lola & Meagan interview Frank Lyford, survivor of Heaven's Gate who left after 18 years--just a few years before discovering his friends and loved ones in the group had died by suicide. In part 1, he tells the girls how he began following the leaders Ti and Do, what it was like living a nomadic lifestyle with his "check partner," and what happened when they all settled in one place
Ashlen Hilliard - The Evolution of Cult Intervention Practices
Cult interventionist and founder of People Leave Cults, Ashlen Hilliard, talks about her path to working in cult intervention and recovery, her personal religious experience that led her to this work, how interactions with Mormons in Utah affected her worldview, how she defines what a cult is, why accusing a group of being a cult isn't always helpful, how cult intervention today is different from
REWIND: Joann Vaega: Waco Survivor and Former Branch Davidian
You're a child living on a remote compound in West Texas. One day authorities show up at your front door and an exchange of gunfire breaks out. Just as you expected would happen. Survivor of the Branch Davidians and the Waco massacre, Joann Vaega, discusses her earliest memories of living on the compound, what cult leader David Koresh was like in person, why she did not feel fear when the siege be
Carolyn Costin - The Link Between Cults and Eating Disorders
FOR OUR 200th EPISODE, we are joined by eating disorder therapist, author, and expert Carolyn Costin to discuss her own experiences that led to her starting her practice, why so many cults control the eating habits of their members, why having an eating disorder is like having a little cult leader in your brain, and how Carolyn helped Meagan with her own eating disorder. Check out our holiday spo
Yoni Shrira, Part 2 - Hard Labor, Isolation, Running Away, and a Dark Legacy
Today is part 2 of our interview with Yoni Shrira, former student at the Family Foundation School, also known as Allynwood, the remote troubled teen program known for a series of lawsuits brought against it as well as over a hundred deaths from overdose or suicide by its former attendees. Last week, we talked about how and why Yoni ended up in the abusive school and the culture of required snitchi
Yoni Shrira, Part 1 - The Family Foundation School, Troubled Teens, and Snitching Culture
Today our guest is Yoni Shrira, friend of the show and survivor of the Family Foundation School, a troubled teen sobriety school that became notorious for how many of its former students died after going through the program. In part one today, he’s going to talk about what he was like as a teenager, how he was genuinely out of control when it came to drugs and alcohol, and why his parents believed
Tory Hess - From Second Life to Wilderness Commune
Today our guest is Tory Hess, former member of a small rural group in upstate New York she calls Crazyland. She tells us about how she always loved reading and fantasy growing up, never went to public school, and didn’t connect easily with folks in real life when she was young, and how she found connection in the online gaming community Second Life, where she acted out her dream of having a family
REWIND: Jay Van Bavel - Groupthink, Social Identity, and Cult Psychology
Groups!... I did it again. Jay Van Bavel, NYU Associate Professor of Psychology and Neural Science, Director of the Social Identity and Morality Lab, and co-author of The Power Of Us, discusses how our social identities change depending on our environment and context, how the groups we identify with affect our decisions and perception, and the importance of instilling healthy hierarchy in a group
Bethany Joy Lenz - One Tree Hill, a Secret Cult, and Living a Double Life
Today our guest is actor, musician, and now author Bethany Joy Lenz, whom we will just call Joy. Joy was the star of hit TV show One Tree Hill, and today she’s going to talk to us about how she was in a Christian cult the whole time she was filming the show. She’ll tell us about her upbringing and her career as a young actor, living in LA on her own and joining a small Bible study group that seeme
Anne - Psychosis, Delusions, & the Cult of Your Own Mind
Today, our guest is a friend who we'll call Anne. We discuss the connection between psychosis and cults, the mental changes Anne experienced when her episode started, the delusions that grew stronger, how she felt like she was communicating with spirits, the paranoia that grew inside her, and how a psychiatric mental health professional helped pull her out of it. We also compare the similarities o
REWIND: Jitarth Jadeja - Former QAnon Believer
Episode 15: Lola and Meagan interview Jitarth Jadeja, former QAnon believer. He tells the girls about how, despite being Australian, he first was a Bernie supporter, then shifted his support to Trump before becoming obsessed with conspiracy theories. They discuss the two years of his life in which he believed in Q, the moment he realized it was all a lie, how he'd have gone to the Capitol if he'd
Gareth Gore - Opus Dei, Human Trafficking, & Project 2025
Today our guest is Gareth Gore, journalist and author whose new book Opus is about Opus Dei, an ultra-conservative Catholic sect, its harmful practices, its history of dark money, and its connections to modern day right-wing American politics. Gareth shares how he came to this story while investigating the shady practices at a bank in Spain, the history of the group and the leader’s goals of recru
Norah - Girls Night In: L.A. Facebook Group Gone Culty
Today our guest is a woman whom we’ll call Norah. She tells us about a Facebook group for women in Los Angeles that ended up getting very culty. We’ll talk about why it was exciting in the beginning to connect with other women in a new way, how other subgroups began to form (including one secret, exclusive one) and how the admin, who we’ll call Vivian, seemed to be creating a space that prioritize
Demetria, Part 2 - Twin Ray Mysticism, Spiritual Retreats, and the Necessity of Rage
Today is part two with Demetria, survivor of the Oregon new age cult, Twin Ray. This week she shares more about the wild claims that the leaders made about their mystical backgrounds, how deeply rooted the culture of self blame was (including blaming one woman for her own cancer), and the massive property they purchased in Oregon which was financed by their followers. We talk about the dangers of
Demetria, Part 1 - Online Gurus, Mysterious Elixirs, and Joining the Twin Ray Cult
Today we're joined by Demetria, survivor of an Oregon new age group called Twin Ray (not to be confused with Twin Flames). She describes the beginning of her spiritual journey including reading the works of Eckhart Tolle, how one specific online guru captured her imagination, and how this guru's partner made the claim that they were Twin Rays with access to special spiritual knowledge despite thei
Joelle Tamraz, Part 2 - Meeting The Elders, Emotional Manipulation, and Moving On
This week is part two of a fascinating discussion with Joelle Tamraz, author of The Secret Practice: 18 Years on the Dark Side of Yoga. The story gets more wild! Joelle shares how her spiritual partner, Arun, became her husband, and how he brought her deeper into his world, including the strange visions he revealed to her. PLUS, the financial abuse, the cheating, the isolation from her family, and
Joelle Tamraz, Part 1 - Traveling to India, Meeting a Swami, and "Past Lives"
Today is part one of our interview with Joelle Tamraz, author of the book The Secret Practice: 18 Years on the Dark Side of Yoga. She will tell us about her introduction to different yoga practices at a young age including TM, or transcendental meditation, the hunger she felt for a deeper spirituality that landed her in India when she was fresh out of Harvard, and how she met Arun, the self-procla
Sara Teitelman - The Culty Elements of Technology
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Min Zhou, Part 2 - Labor Camps, Persecution, and Mass Killings in the Cultural Revolution
In part 2 of our interview with Min Zhou, survivor of the Cultural Revolution and Distinguished Professor of Sociology and Asian American Studies at UCLA, we’re going to talk more about Professor Zhou’s personal experience. We’ll discuss why her dad was a target of the Red Guards, what it felt like knowing her family was in danger at such a young age, how many people were massacred in different pa
Min Zhou, Part 1 - The Cult of Mao Zedong, and Growing Up in the Cultural Revolution
Today is part one with Min Zhou, Distinguished Professor of Sociology and Asian American Studies at UCLA, who also grew up during the Cultural Revolution: a decade of social chaos in China in the 1960s and 1970s where intellectuals, artists, and anyone perceived as representing capitalism or the "old ways" were persecuted and murdered in the hundreds of thousands or more. She’ll tell us about the
Tia Levings, Part 2 - Questioning Fundamentalism, Motherhood, and the Dangers of Christian Nationalism
In part 2 with Tia Levings, author of A Well-Trained Wife: My Escape from Christian Patriarchy, Tia she discusses how, in the midst of a church-sanctioned abusive relationship, motherhood began to change her beliefs - at first making her more zealous. She’ll talk about how her time trying to save her baby in the children’s hospital, plus working with women doctors and nurses, planted the seeds to
Tia Levings, Part 1 - A Well-Trained Wife in the Christian Patriarchy
Today is part one with Tia Levings, author of A Well-Trained Wife: My Escape from Christian Patriarchy. We talk about the church her family joined when she was young, how it was connected to Bill Gothard and the IBLP - which is why you may have seen her in the Amazon docuseries Shiny Happy People - how it grew more fundamentalist, and how she met her ex-husband Allen, who was abusive from the begi
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